Wind instruments

[death_au]

I'd prefer to see Piano / Keyboard implemented first, but I wondered what people thought of wind instruments in FoF/iX? We're talking things like trumpet and saxophone, but it extends to any wind instrument really.

I got this idea ages ago after seeing something about making an air pressure kick pedal for disabled people. Basically in terms of a controller, you'd modify a controller so that you use the air pressure tube as "strum", and have the same old 5 "fret buttons" attached.

In terms of gameplay, it requires some small modifications to current guitar gameplay for a theoretical PART_WIND (Please hold off on the fart jokes)
Sustained notes would require the "strum" to be held down (i.e. constant wind pressure in the sensor). You would also have to stop blowing in between notes in order to register a note as hit, meaning blowing for too long on a short note would be considered an 'overstrum'. An exception is made in the case of what on guitar parts would be called HOPOs. This allows you to chart sustained notes that change pitch as notes that are very close together.

I apologise for my excessive use of guitar terms and relating them to wind instruments, but I'm trying to define it in terms of how FoF/iX currently handles songs.

Feel free to pass along any thoughts on the subject.

[pimpinpalomo]

This would be interesting. FoFiX needs some new instruments to distinguish itself from other rhythm games. I would rather see Keyboard/Piano implemented first though. This actually would be pretty cool since I am currently working on a song that has a sax in it.

[Jama7301]

I've done one chart where I've used a wind/brass instrument. My mindset heading in was pretending that "picking" was more like "blowing" and the frets are just finger movements. This of course has very little to do with your idea though.

The main problem I see though is lack of people willing to fret ska/jazz/orchestra/etc type songs that use a lot of brass/wind instruments. Mostly because they're set with guitars and other stringed instruments. I, of course, could be wrong though, I'm just putting out my 2 cents.

[Naemesis]

Soo... is this compatible with breathing?

[Nickstr07]

^Yes, In theory lol.
Seems interesting, I'd like to see it implimented definitly. But I also think that Keyboard/Piano is easier to impliment and should maybe take premise over Part_WIND .

[ryanpanties]

I'd thought about this awhile back when my ex roommate was charting a trumpet part on his own song. He charted it to expert using relative pitch (guitar-style), then to easy (3-note) using trumpet valve combination to determine buttons pushed rather than pitch.

I like the possibilities, and I think you're right on the money as far as the controller goes. I hadn't imagined an overstrum feature, instead simply relying on the fact that you'll have to take breaths to enforce pauses. For a game-oriented parallel to justify this I would point to Part Vocals, which doesn't penalize you for over-holding notes, instead punishing you for not having enough breath left for the line/word that follows.

I'd be interested in hearing additional details on your thoughts as to what would be needed to fabricate a controller, and how much time/money you envisioned being involved in that process.

Also, I agree that Part_Piano should come first.

[RedShadow]

I've done one chart where I've used a wind/brass instrument. My mindset heading in was pretending that "picking" was more like "blowing" and the frets are just finger movements. This of course has very little to do with your idea though.

The main problem I see though is lack of people willing to fret ska/jazz/orchestra/etc type songs that use a lot of brass/wind instruments. Mostly because they're set with guitars and other stringed instruments. I, of course, could be wrong though, I'm just putting out my 2 cents.

I thought the main problem was people not willing to modify a keyboard or a GuitarControl in such a way

[death_au]

I hadn't imagined an overstrum feature, instead simply relying on the fact that you'll have to take breaths to enforce pauses. For a game-oriented parallel to justify this I would point to Part Vocals, which doesn't penalize you for over-holding notes, instead punishing you for not having enough breath left for the line/word that follows.

Fair point. I only said that because I imagined a part of a song with a number of distinct notes (not HOPO worthy), but as long as you have enough breath for that part you could tap your way through it, which is not accurate to the song at all.
But I guess you're right and you can do the same for vocals, so perhaps it's not as big a deal as I make it out to be

I'd be interested in hearing additional details on your thoughts as to what would be needed to fabricate a controller, and how much time/money you envisioned being involved in that process.

To be honest, I haven't really thought about the specifics of the controller aside from what I mentioned in the first post. Although I imagine a mouthpiece borrowed from another wind instrument (anything from a sax to a recorder, really) with a piezo sensor assembly like in that air pressure kick pedal article attached. All of that would then be attached to something similar to a GH controller neck (basically a tube or stick with 5 coloured buttons on it).
I even thought of having a hinge between the mouthpiece and the "neck", so that you could tilt the "neck" down like a saxaphone, or up like a flute.
You also might need a tilt sensor in there somewhere to activate star power, and maybe even a whammy bar equivalent on the end of the controller to simulate the... Actually, I have no idea what it's called... You know how some trumpeters use an apple or something at the end of the trumpet to block the air and change the pitch? Yeah, that.

When I start getting a decent income, I might look at costing to make a prototype.

[Kueller917]

This seems like a really good idea. I've thought of it crazily, but never thought that a controller could be used. Although if there was a controller how would it look like? There's a lot of wind instruments that could be in Part_WINDS, so what would a controller take the shape of?

[death_au]

Possibly something like this:

(click for more info)
But with big GH-style coloured buttons.
Athough I kinda like my hinge idea, so you could tilt the button part of the controller down to to be vertical like a saxophone

[Kueller917]

Possibly something like this:

(click for more info)
But with big GH-style coloured buttons.
Athough I kinda like my hinge idea, so you could tilt the button part of the controller down to to be vertical like a saxophone

Alright, so universal controller. That's somewhat what I was thinking about. Overall you seem to have looked into this quite a bit. Looks like more of an actual possibility than a random thought. Good luck if you ever try it out

[Naemesis]

My legs are paralyzed and I have astma.

[ryanpanties]

I looked up the price on the instrument pictured above.... "$280.00 new".

I wonder if you could put something together from the guts of a $10 guitar controller.

You could put them inside The Sax-To-Trumpet

[death_au]

It would definitely be hacked together from an ex-guitar controller (I have one with a broken neck which would work if I can fix the neck)
I wasn't considering actually using a $300 usb wind instrument, but it is what a professionally done wind instrument controller might look like.
First version will probably end up looking like this:

(if not messier)

I do like your thinking when it comes to shoving it all in a kids toy, too.

[ryanpanties]

Yeah, i have 4 or 5 guitars including one with a cracked-by-battleaxe body, so i opened it up. I'm looking at a GH2 360 Xplorer, and there's not really too much to fit into a wind instrument body. Maybe not a flute, but something. If you want to use the strumbar for anything you'd have to arrange for it to allow for continuous pressure rather than clicks, so you'd probably be better off using the start and back button for blow and mute, ignoring the strum and whammy bar completely.

That's all i got so far.